Divergent States
Divergent States cuts through psychedelic hype with grounded, curious conversations about what these substances actually do.
Hosted by 3L1T3, founder of r/Psychonaut, the world’s largest psychedelic harm-reduction community, and co-hosted by Bryan, a USMC veteran and advocate for psychedelic healing, the show brings together lived experience, science, and culture without losing its sense of humor.
This isn’t a spiritual podcast.
This isn’t a marketing platform.
No mysticism. No sales pitch. Just real conversations, harm reduction, and honest questions.
We explore how psychedelics shape mental health, creativity, and society, from underground use and peer-support communities to clinical trials, therapy rooms, and shifting public attitudes. Some episodes get serious. Some get weird. All of them are grounded in respect for the people actually taking these substances and living with the outcomes.
Guests include Rick Doblin, Reggie Watts, Leonard Pickard, Anne Wagner, Hamilton Morris, and Rick Strassman.
Divergent States is built on the same principles that made r/Psychonaut work at scale: curiosity without gullibility, openness without losing your footing, and safety without killing the joy.
If you’re looking for guru worship, this isn’t your show.
If you’re looking for thoughtful, funny, and grounded conversations about psychedelics and the lives they touch, welcome to Divergent States.
New episodes every two weeks.
Divergent States
The Art of Psychedelic Peer Support | Zendo Project
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What actually happens when a psychedelic experience becomes overwhelming in the middle of a concert, festival, or crowded event?
3L1T3 and Bryan sit down with Case Newsom, emergency medicine physician and medical director of the Zendo Project, to explore the practical art of psychedelic peer support. Case explains why helping someone through a difficult trip often means resisting the urge to take control, offering simple choices, and creating enough safety for the experience to unfold.
They also discuss Zendo’s integration with medical and security teams at Red Rocks, why emergency rooms can intensify psychedelic distress, and how compassionate on-site care can prevent unnecessary restraint, sedation, and hospitalization. Case shares how one major Denver event went from 54 hospital transports to 17 after psychedelic peer support was embedded alongside medical services.
The conversation expands beyond festivals into the larger need for harm reduction, community support, and psychedelic literacy as these substances become increasingly accessible.
Disclosure: 3L1T3 and Bryan are Zendo Project Ambassadors. They are volunteers, not employees, but may receive financial benefit when listeners use the code DIVERGENTS10 for eligible Zendo Project training programs.
Learn more at ZendoProject.org.
Key Points
- What psychedelic peer support looks like in practice
- The difference between supporting an experience and trying to control it
- Why presence can be more helpful than offering solutions
- How Zendo combines peer support with medical triage
- Bringing psychedelic harm reduction into Red Rocks
- Working alongside security, EMTs, and venue staff
- How on-site support can reduce unnecessary hospital transports
- Why emergency rooms can intensify psychedelic distress
- The importance of consent and non-directive language
- Supporting someone whose friends have abandoned or overwhelmed them
- The difference between a difficult trip and a traumatic experience
- Why integration and follow-up support matter
- Building safer systems for underground psychedelic use
- How this work changed Case’s own relationship with psychedelics
Music is Hourglass Hustlin' - Flintwick
00:00:00 A Difficult Trip at Red Rocks
00:01:45 What Psychedelic Peer Support Looks Like
00:03:20 Zendo Disclosure
00:05:19 Meet Case Newsom
00:06:55 From Emergency Medicine to Zendo
00:11:08 The Origins of the Zendo Project
00:13:25 Supporting Without Directing
00:16:28 Learning How to Be Present
00:17:11 Receiving Peer Support
00:19:07 Resisting the Urge to Fix
00:20:32 Choices Instead of Control
00:23:19 The Mushroom Tent Story
00:25:39 Bringing Zendo to Red Rocks
00:27:04 Building Peer Support Into First Aid
00:29:26 Security, Medical, and Psychological Safety
00:30:24 Reducing Ambulance Transports
00:33:13 Why the ER Can Make Trips Worse
00:36:01 Stigma, Authority, and Trust
00:39:06 Creating Connection in a Crisis
00:42:41 The Gaps in Psychedelic Harm Reduction
00:46:33 Underground Communities and Safety
00:48:46 The Future of Zendo
00:53:06 Why Venues Need Peer Support
00:54:28 How Presence Prevents Panic
00:58:01 Closing the Public Interview
01:00:08 Episode Outro
Download the app or text/call 62-FIRESIDE
Our listeners get 10% off the Zendo Project SIT Program with the code DIVERGENTS10
Disclaimer: This post contains affiliate links. If you make a purchase, I may receive a commission at no extra cost to you.
Special Thanks to our Macrodosers, Super D and Mike, and our Thumbprint Tier member, Angie on Patreon!
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